Monday, August 14, 2006
The Honest Public License
A few weeks ago, I wrote a post about my way of doing dual licensing, keeping myself honest with the open source community. Today, I would like to turn the table and ask the community to be honest with itself.The problem I am addressing is the famous "ASP loophole" of the GPL v2. Famous because everybody in the industry talks about it, but nobody has ever done anything about it ;-) The loophole is easy to explain: GPL v2 talks about distribution of software and includes a copyleft clause that triggers when you distribute your code (that is, everything around the code becomes GPL as well). In 1991, we used floppies to distribute software. I still remember booting Linux with the boot and root floppies and getting the network piece of the OS with N1, N2, etc. Nowadays, the world of software is seeing a shift to distributing software as a service (SaaS). I believe 90% of the software will be distributed as SaaS in the coming years.
What's the ASP loophole? Some people interpret distribution of software as a service not as distribution of software (because GPL v2 was created before web services were on the horizon and therefore did not address them in the license). They believe that they can use open source software to offer services to the public, without returning anything to the community. That's taking open source software as free beer. It is just not being honest with the community, to the people who sweat to write the code to see someone running away with it and not contributing anything back. That's totally against the spirit of free software and the GPL. You have the freedom to use it for yourself or internally in your organization, but when you distribute it to the public, you have to give back to the community. It is that simple. That's the spirit of GPL. That's why open source will take over the world of software: it creates great software and phenomenal support.
I have always included distribution of software as a service in my interpretation of the GPL, but I am not a lawyer. And lawyers always find a way around something, if it is not spelled out in a clear way (I am talking about my brother, mostly ;-) Therefore, for my interpretation to be valid, a brief clarification of the GPL v2 is needed.
That's why we created the first draft of the Honest Public License, a slight modification of GPL v2 with just an additional paragraph (here you can see the diff between HPL and GPL v2). We took that paragraph from the latest draft of GPL v3, relaxing it a bit (what's in GPL v3 was taken from AGPL, but I feel it to be too strong, since it is not based on trust -> I trust my community, I do not need to force them to open a service for me to suck up their code). The goal is to make HPL upward compatible with GPL v3 as much as possible (one note: the FSF is thinking about the ASP loophole, not just Affero or me ;-) We sent it to the FSF for review (I would love to keep the preamble, if they allow me to do it), to lots of open source luminaries (that gave it the thumbs up) and intend to submit it to the OSI.
The goal of HPL is to keep the community honest with itself. The use of the name "Honest" is ABSOLUTELY not intended to mean that GPL or any other licenses are dishonest. It is quite the opposite, actually. But some people are taking advantage of a GPL legal loophole and are defeating the spirit of the GPL. HPL is just GPL extended to cover the distribution of software as a service to the public. It does not take away any freedom (i.e. you can use it internally in your corporation), it just covers when someone distributes the code to the public (whether with a floppy or as a service). It is meant to keep people honest with their community.
What motivated this new license now? We have a general availability version of Funambol coming out in September. I already know there are commercial companies that are live with our code and do not return anything. More than two years ago, we did something similar, switching Sync4j from BSD to GPL. There were companies taking our code and running away with it, without returning anything. One even managed to get public with software based on our code, and our community never saw a line of their modifications. Now is no different. On top of this, I followed a discussion on Matt's blog, which made me think that nobody has ever done anything about the loophole because large interests are at stake (I really would love to see the improvements to the Linux file system that have been made, I could use them for my open source project ;-)
In any case, this is a battle for open source, not against anyone in particular. It is a fight to keep the spirit of open source alive, more than anything else. We'll keep the license open for comments for thirty days (please click on comments below to leave your opinion) and then we will finalize it. My hope is that HPL one day will disappear because GPL v3 will supersede it. I plan to work hard to make it happen in the upcoming months.
Posted by Fabrizio at 07:54
43 Comments:
Donald C. Kirker said...
Very interesting reading.
I am a little bit confused with the second paragraph and what distributing software as a service is exactly. I am trying to put together what it means, but it just doesn't seem like my definition is correct (maybe it is, but I don't think it is because I think it would be wrong to do).
Also, what does this mean for charging for GPL software (mainly fees for support and the like)?
-Donald
Comment Posted at 10:54
Fabrizio said...
Hi Donald,
distributing software as a service is offering software in ASP, where you do not physically ship the software to your users.
The HPL does not have anything to do with charging, it is exactly as GPL (same answer as to the "how do I charge for GPL software?" question).
Comment Posted at 11:22
Donald C. Kirker said...
Ok, I get it now! The customer never actually obtains the software, it just runs on the "providers" servers. I would guess that this would be similar to Google Calendar or Spreadsheet?
I think I see the loophole now. Under the GPL an ASP could host the software, and not provide the source code, correct? With the HPL, the ASP would have to provide the source code?
Comment Posted at 11:29
Hi Fabrizio,
I think I understand where you are coming from with your HPL proposal; if people run the licensed software as a service, they need to pass on the license and make the source code available to all users. I'm curious how this works for Funambol's business model though.
Funambol has a dual-licensing approach, currently either commercial or GPL. But in my interpretation, currently under the GPL, and even under this new HPL license, if a company wanted to run a Funambol server and charge end-users for access to the service, they could still do this without paying Funambol any commercial licensing fees, as long as they are willing to make the source code available to any user that requests it. Does Funambol plan to make money by hoping people will pay for a commercial license just to avoid the burden of delivering source code upon request? Even when customizations are made to use the Funambol software with a proprietary system, the 'connector' model can be used to isolate the proprietary system and limit the amount of 'custom' code that needs to be released to only the code in the 'connector' module. If connecting to a proprietary system were not possible without making source code of the proprietary system available, then how can Funambol release an Exchange connector under GPL without also releasing the Exchange source code?
I guess the HPL would protect against people making significant changes to the Funambol server and making that the core of their business, without giving the code back to the community. Using the software for any use, personal or commercial, would still be allowed as long as changes to the software itself are made available.
- cj
Comment Posted at 06:43
Fabrizio said...
Hi cj,
if people run Funambol as a service and return their changes and stuff around it (GPL is viral...) to the community, I am totally fine. Everybody will benefit, including us. That's the spirit of open source. What bothers me is that some think they can run away with the code and not return anything to the community. Open source is not free as in free beer. You have to pay: give back the code.
Obviously, for people that do not want to give back, the honest dual licensing applies. It is quid pro quo: you give back code or you give back cash, that we are going to use to improve the product (and pay for our kids going to school). There is no free beer.
Comment Posted at 10:19
Fabrizio said...
Hi Donald,
you got it perfectly right.
fabrizio
Comment Posted at 10:20
Hi everybody!
My question: where do you draw the line?
Case1: I change something deep inside Funambol server
Case2: I build a new SyncSource
Case3: I develop a WebApplication using/controling Funambol server functionality on an unchanged Funambol Server
Case4: I develop a WebApplication using the data syncd by Funambol Server
When should I provide my sourcecode?
Another question: How do you define "public"?
Thanks for your comments,
Markus
Comment Posted at 10:52
Patrick Ohly said...
I understand what you are trying to
achieve and am sympathetic with it. Having said that, I'd also have to
raise my concerns:
1. The new license must be GPL compatible, i.e. it must be possible to link GPL libraries against it without requiring special permissions from the authors of those libraries. The Affero license tried something similar as you, but that made it GPL incompatible [1]. If the new license is not GPL-compatible, then this license change will hurt the open source community considerably. This applies to both the client and the server side.
2. The legal status and the GPL compatibility of the new license must be very clear and should be evaluated by authorities in the field, ideally the FSF itself. Otherwise there'll always be doubt about the legality of linking it against GPL - I personally have those doubts and it will require some very good arguments to convince me otherwise.
3. A clarification of how the GPL/HPL applies to Java would be beneficial. If you aggregate different modules on an application server, does that constitute linking? Probably not. Are custom SyncSources linked into the Funambol server in the sense of the GPL? I suppose they are, even if they are installed separately.
[1] http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/license-list.html#TOCGPLIncompatibleLicenses
Comment Posted at 12:58
Tomasz Mazurek said...
You've made some nice points about dishonesty of the loophole abusers, but you haven't stated much arguments from a less moral and more pragmatic point of view.
I wrote quite a lengthy article on the subject of Free Software and SaaS. Especialy the last part titled "Economic impact of the GPL" may be interesting to you as it stresses the significance of the proper viral clause effect.
You can read it at:
http://astariand.com/wikka.php?wakka=FreeServices
Comment Posted at 19:06
The HPL seems illegal !
The GPL clearly states at the very beginning :
"Everyone is permitted to copy and distribute verbatim copies of this license document, but changing it is not allowed."
In the current legal context this restriction is an unfortunate necessity.
Mister Capobianco openly admits to not having permission to use the GPL in this way. Here we have a person who has basically stolen the GPL, added a clause, changed it's name and called it a "new" licence.
I wonder if he has considered participating in the discussion about the next generation of FSF licences, even if this means dealing with people who have different opinions than him, and people who can be on occasion rather opinionated. He could probably contribute greatly to the community, as his points seem otherwise valid.
Another point : I find this constant description of the GPL as "viral" rather frustrating. First a product may by no means be "contaminated" by GPL code, it's owners must *choose* to use the GPL. In a world where states are allowed to dictate how an individual is allowed to use knowledge, some are grateful that the laws that are used to control knowledge can also be used to force it to be free. The use of the GPL is a choice, a political choice. There are other licences, open source or otherwise which may be used, and are in some cases this is preferable (the FSF recommends releasing code snippets as Public Domain for example). In the end the choice is in the hands of the developers, the GPL doesn't force them into anything, unless they are distributing somebody else code, in which case they must share.
Comment Posted at 07:59
Fabrizio said...
Patrick, Markus,
you touched on the most important aspect of this change for our product. Where you draw the line?
I feel we should make sure that HPL is compatible to other OSS licenses, when it comes to building a SyncSource or a Client. MySQL had the same problem, so did Hyperic. The solution could be something like the FLOSS exception of MySQL (check it on their site). We could relax the license for clients and connectors, to allow different OSS licenses to work when integrating with our server. That would solve any incompatibility problem and foster development of even more clients and connectors (even BSD ones).
On the definition of "public", I believe it to be clear enough. If you using internally (yourself or your organization), you are not giving it to the public. If you are offering an ASP service to the public... that's easy. It is the same as distribution with GPL: when does it apply? When you get a CD from your IT manager? When you give it to a customer?
Cheers,
fabrizio
Comment Posted at 12:32
Fabrizio said...
Hi Tomasz,
very interesting article.
I really like the Greater GPL concept. I disagree on Linux not caring about what Google is doing to it. I am sure the file system changes are something spectacular, that everyone in the OS community would like to see (despite Google - for now - does not have an OS competing with Linux).
In general, I loved your article. I would like to see if we can make HPL the "Greater GPL", because virality is what made open source what it is today. If we relax it, we are toasted.
fabrizio
Comment Posted at 12:38
Fabrizio said...
Dear anonymous,
we asked the FSF for permission to change the GPL and they told it was ok for us to do it, but we should remove the preamble. I can assure you HPL is not illegal. We are talking to the FSF and waiting for feedback, which will be incorporated in the next draft. We care about what the FSF thinks. We want this to be a temporary step forward towards GPL v3.
Your comment "In the end the choice is in the hands of the developers, the GPL doesn't force them into anything, unless they are distributing somebody else code, in which case they must share." makes my day. Let me subscribe to it and HPL saying "distributing software including distributing software as a service" and we are on the same page.
BTW, I love opinionated people and discussions. Funambol is a very large open source project. It is full of opinionated people. If I did not care about opionions, I would have changed our license, called Funambol Public License. I did not. I threw the concept out, for discussion with opinionated people. It is the best way to improve your ideas in the first place.
Thanks for contributing to the debate.
fabrizio
Comment Posted at 12:43
Hi everybody!
Fabrizio, thanks for your comment.
Actually I think my post was not really interpreted the way I intended.
To be HONEST: I am a student of computer science, I just started to get used to Funambol server, I have a new idea for an application based on Funambol server provided as a service and my primary goal is to make money with that idea as I have to earn some after graduation.
From my point of view, many successfull and complex open source projects are driven by companies, often with dual licensing (see JBoss, Mysql, Funambol etc.). Thier business models only work because there are companies out there that don't want to use GPL and pay for not using it. This business model is not possible for ASP when their service is based on GPL/HPL, neither is consultancy (at least I haven't seen a possibility yet).
To be not missunderstood: I don't want to take free software as free beer, but I acutally see big problems as I don’t see any other ASP business model then by user fees or by ads.
Given I realized my idea, put it on a small server I can afford starting my business. Anyone can take it, put it on a faster server with more space for user data and make the money (given my idea works). How can you solve that dilemma?
To be true – I don’t know. The only thing I can image (even if I know this point rises new problems to discuss) is making ASPs to make their changed code public a certain time after they release a feature to public. This would give them some possibility to make money / grow their community but their code gets back to the open source community (not immediately of course).
If you really decide to intorduce the HPL, I think it is very very important to draw the lines in the ASP point with clear concrete examples in an less abstract view than in the discussions above (please feel free to refer to my cases posted before) because there is nothing you can refer to yet. Also and especially if it comes to other services provided by the same ASP that are somehow connected to Funambol server.
I like the idea of Open Souce but I just can’t see how the HPL works together with ASP business models (which is needed if you don’t do it just for fun or to complete your other services).
Awaiting your comments,
Markus
BTW: Maybe you should put a link to this discussion on www.funambol.com/opensource
Comment Posted at 10:15
Patrick Ohly said...
Fabrizio,
you replied to my concerns that the HPL might make it illegal to combine it with GPL libraries saying that "The solution could be something like the FLOSS exception of MySQL (check it on their site)."
I had a look and found that this does not address my concerns: MySQL is pure GPL, with the mentioned FLOSS exception which relaxes the license to allow linking against libraries that are not GPL and not already compatible with it.
The HPL might turn out to be one of those incompatible licenses, so you would have to ask the MySQL authors to add the HPL to their exception list, then repeat that with every other GPL library again and again...
Let me repeat: it's not your permission which is needed (and which you certainly would be happy to grant), it is the permission of every other involved party because their GPL license might not allow linking against HPL.
Best regards, Patrick
Comment Posted at 11:21
Fabrizio said...
Hi Patrick,
I am not convinced you are right (I feel HPL will be incompatible with GPL, but it will be ok with a FLOSS exception that also includes GPL), but I am not a lawyer. In any case, do not worry, top open source luminaries and lawyers are working on it, collecting all the feeback we are getting. We'll get everything clarified for the next draft.
Cheers.
fabrizio
Comment Posted at 19:27
Markus,
The whole point of the change is that you can't take the server, develop something for it and not release the changes *without paying money to Funambol* to license the server under commercial license.
So if you want to pursue your "business model" you have to include the price of the license in your business costs, or build the server functionality yourself (or use earlier Sync4j version which is under GPL, or use a competing product if you can get it for a lower price).
I can see why Funambol the company wants this change - after all their product is a middleware product which is almost solely (I guess) used as a part of an "software as a service" -model and making money selling licenses might be harder than with "traditional" GPL software - for an example there is a great number of companies paying license fees to MySQL AB (we are...) because they are building products where they embed MySQL. Selling a software product where Funambol is embedded is much more uncommon, I think...
And yes, we are using Sync4j at the moment too, and evaluating our options - publishing our SyncSource is one option although it is of no use without the software it connects to, and because that software is an in-house application the SyncSource would be of very little use to anyone.
What is bothering me is incertainty - when will the next license change occur and what would that be? What is the price to pay (and future price?) if we want to be certain that development on Funambol is the right choice? Should we be better off with a fully commercial (closed source) product?
This is not a very simple matter...
Kari
Comment Posted at 01:59
Fabrizio said...
Hi Kari,
I believe your comment on our product being used mostly as a service is right to the point. With HPL, we just want people to return their code back to the community.
If people do not want to return their code, Funambol embeds the Honest Dual Licensing model that accommodates that need.
It is your choice, quid pro quo: you either return code to the community or give cash to Funambol which will be used to improve the code for the community. I personally suggest you open source your code (I am assuming my salespeople do not read this blog :-) but it is your choice.
Regarding your questions:
- you can definitely sell your SyncSource, even if you make it available under HPL (or GPL or any other license we will make it compatible with)
- when will the HPL be final? By mid September, when we will release Funambol 3.0 GA
- would you better off with a commercial product? I do not think so, the advantages of open source are clearly there, even if you do not want to open source your code. At the end of the day, it is the same codebase plus support directly from the people that write that code. It is future proof: you have the code (!!) and if we get hit by a bus, you'll keep it and you'll find many people able to help you on it (a.k.a. the "bus factor").
Cheers,
fabrizio
Comment Posted at 12:35
Fabrizio,
Thank you for your time and answers.
To clarify a few points:
- I am well aware of the advantages of open source software. In a sense (as you pointed out) it is "a safer option" than a closed source one. What I was referring to was that to invest development and testing time to a product it is nice to have a clear path and some promise of the associated costs and needed licenses - at the present time *and* in the forseeable future. I understand that the license to Sync4j has changed in the past, and it is now changing again. This is bad. I should probably call the sales people...
- If it comes to that we decide that we need the Funambol 3.0 instead of the current version, we will probably just publish the sync source code. But as I said - it is of no use to anyone outside our organization because it relies on an in-house backend which is not available publicly (more precisely it just communicates over JDBC to database which has a schema very specific to this application). Only thing is that I have to clean up the code, remove some comments and abstract the SQL a bit more - that is causing "unnecessary" costs, but hey, maybe it is for good...
-Kari
Comment Posted at 14:57
Tomasz Mazurek said...
I am wondering if and how HPL (or Greater GPL, heh) should relate to Terms of Service - after all ToS are also some form of license agreement and surely each service provider should be allowed to create his own Terms of Service - they can be very different even among similar services.
Example: somebody creates brilliant webmail service for spammers - with support for databases of open relays, automatic From field changing, babelfishing spam to national languages and wormnet control panel. In his ToS he definitely won't forbid spam. But later on somebody else modifies the code and using it creates anonymizing service. In his ToS he might want to forbid spam.
Another thing - perhaps there should be a requirement or suggestion that an information about software licensing and source availability should be present in ToS.
Comment Posted at 19:24
Fabrizio said...
An update on the HPL review process: we met with the lawyer today and we probably are going to keep HPL for the server and GPL for the client, to make things easier for everybody. In general, HPL does not make sense for clients, which are not used as services (...), so let's not complicate things. I hope this will solve the issues raised by Patrick.
In the meantime, we are pushing forward to get more comments from FSF. Eben Moglen, general counsel of FSF, in an interview << made it clear that he does not object to the idea behind the license, which he called "a perfectly legitimate position about how community ought to work, that if people produce code from commons to offer services," they should give back the code. >> He also said the timing was not great, but unfortunately we could not do anything different. We cannot release 3.0 GA in March 2007... I am really looking forward to talking to them asap (I understand they are in India at the moment).
fabrizio
Comment Posted at 21:33
Patrick Ohly said...
Hello Fabrizio,
yes, keeping the client code under GPL avoids the problem for me, but have the question that I raised been clarified?
A server developer still faces the same problems: is it legal to link GPL libraries against a server under HPL? To which extend does the HPL apply to server SyncSources that are installed into the server and/or distributed together with it?
These will be frequently asked questions and it would be good if Funambol published answers to them together with the 3.0 HPL licensed server.
Bye, Patrick
Comment Posted at 00:55
Fabrizio said...
Hi Patrick,
few quick answers, that we definitely will clarify in a FAQ.
> A server developer still faces the same problems: is it legal to link GPL libraries against a server under HPL?
No, HPL will clearly end up in the incompatibility list, as AGPL. So you will not be able to link a GPL library against the Funambol server. Your SyncSource must be HPL. However, because of dual licensing, Funambol could grant a special waiver for open source project that cannot switch the SyncSource to HPL.
> To which extend does the HPL apply to server SyncSources that are installed into the server and/or distributed together with it?
It applies.
Ciao,
fabrizio
Comment Posted at 11:55
Well.
GPL is a good licence. I can sell GPL program as long as I provide source code of software. It has been Idea of GPL all the time. If I modify software I have to give source code to others. If I provide this kind of software as service/ASP, it is same idea than If I sell it other way..
This is original idea of GPL. If you do not like it, don't use that license.
Comment Posted at 05:09
business licenses said...
I'm affraid I'm not always as tech savy as I'd like to be- I'm not fully aware what the ASP Loophole is. Though, from context, it sounds like a loophole that lets companies not provide their new modified source because the code never actually leaves their servers, but is actually interfaced with through the internet. Am I correct in this? If so, that's incredibly shady.
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Comment Posted at 01:13
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